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  • 116

Fraport will use FlightAware data – What does that mean for the whole ATM community?

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We are now entering a time where a private organization, not run by a state, can provide better data and prediction than national or even trans-national ANSPs. In this age of data, it is also likely that FlightAware and the like can provide better flight profile and performance data than theory and research based models like BADA. (radar.foxatm.com) More...

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NF2G
David Stark 8
Actual observation always produces better data than theoretical modeling.
cwhitt
Christopher Whitt 3
I understand the point you are trying to make, but it's not actually always true, depending on what you mean by "better data". Some things are simply very difficult to observe, so if you can make a few high-quality observations to validate a very good model, you get a much better picture of a process than if you interpolate between many poor observations. (yes, I'm being pedantic)
NF2G
David Stark 3
I suppose I should have said that using observed data produces better models and predictions than estimated or interpolated data, or building a model based on another model that has little supporting observational evidence.
cwhitt
Christopher Whitt 4
Yes, I totally agree with that. :)
rad2
Roger Deeringer 1
The basic issue will be in the agreement which should address the ultimate responsibility for final delivery of the service. No party should be allowed to simply walk away from any operation that may not be following expected, or normal, flow. Take Apollo 13 as an example, things are totally normal until, BANG. Now it's time to act and act correctly. Failure is not an option, the mission, and perhaps lives are in the balance. Yes, many extra hours of effort and man-hours will be required, and there may not be any hope of monetary compensation. In the case of resource failure, the comm satellite just got hit with a Coronal Mass Ejection and further data updates are just plain gone, something is going to have to replace that missing data. First in the near term, in order to get the current load of flights safely on the ground. Then longer term, how to get back to normal operation, where the AI has all the inputs required to deliver the expected results. Will the legal troops be able to sort this out, to arrive at a reasonable agreement? At what cost?

The reason an AI based solution can work better and faster, is the lack of political boundaries. The AI looks at a global picture, not something that stops at the shore. Can the EU pull this off? What global body can assure a global approach to the agreement? The UN? I don't think so.

Therefore, I can't imagine this type of solution working on a wide-spread basis anytime soon. A lot of control will have to be turned over to the AI and the global will, or trust, is not yet on the horizon.
pthomas745
Pa Thomas 1
I see Robert Poole has a disciple in Europe.
Quirkyfrog
Robert Cowling -8
This is the mantra of the current US administration. Government is the problem, doesn't create jobs, and corporations can do the job better.

No, corporations can't do it better. Corporations CAN overcharge for the functions, screw if up, and walk away blameless, and contribute nearly unlimited money to politicians ensuring their position, and getting even more government functions assigned to them. Sad...
afcjr1201
Allen Churchwell 0
sad that you had to bring a negative one-off opinion about politics re: "current US administration"
raykhughes
ray hughes 1
Our global mid sized airport employed Fraport as a consultancy a couple of years ago - the results so far are a lesson on how not to rely so heavily on automation and meta data. There are times when it is eerily accurate and other times when it is so off target your extra staffing levels are left with nothing to do..not to mention major department disruptions as the airport changes its levels of response. What I see, is a rise in share price and Senior executive bonus payouts at the expense of increased workloads on operational staff as they try to understand and work with IT glitches that where supposed to make things easier and in fact have complicated matters when they go very wrong. Resonse times for IT 24 support have also complicated matters..(Dial 1 for this, 2 for that..etc) Also a heavy reliance on lower cost IT subcontractors who know nothing about airport operations because it is not relevant to their IT role..This is a potential disaster in the making. This is Neo liberal free market capitalism and frankly I am over it because in the end after the inevitable disasters, the tax payer ends up picking up the cost.

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